The Twelve Gods of Magic

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Permalink Reply by Divinities Creature on November 10, 2008 at 2:22pm

- creeps into the discussion to add my voice-
I think everyone should strive to reach personal achievements and growth as you have Alor. The image and energy of this discussion reflects that (though more subtly) which exists outside of the discussion in the world. People are questioned, damned, perecuted, killed, and prejudiced because of personal practices. Be it spititual, mental, emotional, or physical. Each and every belief system of every living being has things in common with each other, and differences. I don't believe anyone has it all figured out, not you, not me, not buddha, not barack obama(pun sorry =D) we just all have the pieces. You can see for yourself when you learn new things, your opinions change, sometimes you make a complete 360 and believe something you had shunned before. Their are a miriad of possibilities that are ever growing. One of the many truths I have learned is that you can NEVER overtake the TRUE divine. Sometimes you see the edge and move towards it, only to find when you get there, that the edge is not there at all, it has grown and changed and it is still on the horizon.
Personally, as far as my beliefs go, I believe that I AM divine. I work through myself and myself only. I associate with the gods/goddesses as equals if anything. I am all that which I need. The power is within me and not without. I do not call on any god or goddess, but I acknowledge them and I seem to reap the same benefits among them as my consorts. I am growing and changing yet I am always constant. My beliefs hinge on what I call "truths". They are universal truths that no matter what happens they will forever be true.
But enough of that, I respect you and your beliefs and believe that we all could learn a valuable lesson from you.
My blessings, Alor

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Permalink Reply by Alorer the Greek (Wyatt) on November 10, 2008 at 2:32pm

Thank you a lot!
I do see Gods as consorts, friends, like older brothers and sisters... They are not more important than us... all parts of the One are equally important... I just see them as more powerful given they are the greatest of the One's parts...
I do have power but the physical World (Nature) has power as well, the spiritual World (all kinds of spiritual planes) has power, the Gods have power... all things have power... I mostly use my own power... And to tell you the truth I rarely "ask" the Gods for assistance... they grant me my wishes and help me even without asking them... I believe this is the major difference between ALL of the ancient Gods and Jehovah... they don't expect you to offer them anything and then help... they help you anyway no matter what you want to do... their main duty is to help all so they give us a boost of energy and after that how to use it lies in our hands... they don't intervene with that... the consequences will happen on their own according to our actions... the Gods merely do their job to "power you up"... I hope this is clear!
Blessings!

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Permalink Reply by Divinities Creature on November 10, 2008 at 3:02pm

Indeed, I couldnt have said it better, consorts, equals, kin. Not some all-powerful entity that we must worship or forever burn for it. But I'm getting off topic. Also, I dislike calling the god's/goddess's by either of those names. I hardly ever use god or goddess when I acknowledge them on a personal level and I know they acknowledge me on a personal level as well. I think it's almost degrading to call them a god or goddes when personally they are so much more to the individual.
Of course, this is only my view and this is the way I see them. I realize that many would never ever even approach innanna on a personal level. It requires a certain amount of strength to do so. But I always astral travel when I interact with my consorts.
I have not been one to work spells, although the few that I have have turned out spectacularly! Things just always seem to work out in my favour. If I need money, I get it, even without asking. I just mentally note that I need money, and I end up receiving. It has been like that since I have recognized myself as divine.
And as divine I think I have a broader mind. I have my opinions but I am less judgemental. I respect life's lessons and try not to interfere with more than a little advice here and there. This requires ALOT of patience and patience is a virtue.
A prime example involves my best friend right now. Its complicated and there is alot more to the story than I can tell but basically she wants to date a guy who isnt sure if he is straight or not. He dated her once and then they broke up because he felt like he wasnt being completely honest with her because of his feelings for men. Now he isnt dating anyone but he is sleeping with a guy he used to date who still claims to love him and she is still trying to get him back. Basically the guy she wants has his cake and eats it too.
I have gently told her no good will come of this and it would be best to walk away, but she immediately let me know that she has strong feelings about walking away and I shut my mouth lol.
I cant tell her anything because it will negatively affect our relationship as friends and I dont want her to look at me negatively. So it's best that she learns this lesson on her own.
=D wheww..and imagine that was the long story short
That's just the point I wanted to make,
God's act in the same way, advising us but at the same time we have free will. It's my opinion that when you meddle in someone's free will you will go down with them. Which is why you are taught not to.

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Permalink Reply by Alorer the Greek (Wyatt) on November 10, 2008 at 4:58pm

I see... I agree for the most part... The same things happen to me but I haven't declared myself as divine... I accept that we have a part of divinity (our soul) but I don't see myself as completely divine... Also I like calling them by their names or even God or Goddess... They haven't been offended so far hehe... I see it right to call them that way since not calling them Gods to me is like not calling a person "human"... I agree with the rest you said!

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Permalink Reply by Alorer the Greek (Wyatt) on November 10, 2008 at 5:04pm

Conflict? Where? I thought this was exchanging of theories and beliefs... It isn't a conflict to say different things... and also, Wicca itself is quite new... only the elements in it are ancient... Thelema was made by Crowley... based on ancient elements of Magic... my path is quite the same... it is a personal belief system based on elements of both new and ancient religions...

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Permalink Reply by Divinities Creature on November 10, 2008 at 6:04pm

I believe you are trying to understand what I am saying from your point of view Jo, and that's alright, I am not offended. It's just that I think we can both agree that we see things very differently, lol. I don't see the god and goddess as a divine couple that I should worship. They may very well be a divine couple, but I suppose the closest I come to worship them is on a deeply personal level. My altar is my mind and capabilities it contains. I don't make circles when I interact with them.(And before I get preached to, I take matters into my own hands about what I let into my sphere of being and what I dont. I am well aware that all wiccans make circles before doing any spell work or practice as a precautionary means.) If im going to take anything away from my experience it will be the good AND the bad, the light AND the dark. I practice what I call endarkenment, which is exploring the dark side of your soul and nature as well as the light.(Which is why I do not follow the wiccan rede or the rule of three.) Does the goddess not have a darker side? How can a balanced individual claim to be wholesome when they exclude the dark thoughts,ideas,images that float through their minds on a day-to-day basis? When I say dark, I don't mean things like sacrifices,murder, or torture. There is a difference between dark and psycho lol. When I say dark I mean the things we suppress. Death, infertility, bad memories, unjustices done, anger, decay, etc these are the things we hate to think about and possibily the things people should learn to look at more. I am a creature of the light and the sun. My sign is leo. But by looking at the darker side of myself and MAKING myself explore it, I have come to terms and learned to live with the things that hurt me. And thus I have become a stronger, more balanced soul.
When I interact with the gods and goddesses I dont call them father, mother, brother, sister, kin, god, goddess, or anything of the sort. Rather I conect with them at a divine level and there words arent necessary. This is the deeply personal aspect that I mentioned, this is what I meant if it clarifies anything. If anything I call them ishtar, isis, lilitu, etc. But never goddess and/or god.
I am disappointed that we cannot reach an understanding on common ground for our differences of belief Jo, but alas, this is what we have.
I look forward to speaking with you further perhaps in future discussions. You seem like a knowledgable individual.

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Permalink Reply by Alorer the Greek (Wyatt) on November 10, 2008 at 5:01pm

My path IS paganism Joanne... It is my own and since I blended elements of other religions (Pagan) then in a way I did started it... The Gods aren't my own... their names and way of worship however are since I created them... the holidays, their titles, the rituals... Their spheres of effect and the Gods themselves however are very real and of everyone... Now if you are questioning the divine aspect of them... or don't like what i'm saying... then don't reply!

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Permalink Reply by Divinities Creature on November 11, 2008 at 1:24pm

I think paganism is a very broad term. In roman times pagan was anything outside of christianity, that's ALOT! And today, I believe it still encompases a very large range of god/goddess belief systems. Pagan and wiccan are not interchangeable, although people use both time and time again. Being wiccan is a modern version of ancient celtic beliefs. But being pagan could mean a variety of things. The simplest definition of paganism, I think, would be ANY belief system where both a gods and goddesses are worshipped. This excludes monotheistic religions which are dominant in the world today. Such as christianity, islam, etc. it would include very ancient religions dating back to the early america's, egypt, sumer, greece, persia, china, central and south america, europe, africa, and the isles of britian. Yes, wicca is a small slice of a bigger pie, as are most things. But wicca does not encompass all of the things paganism does. This is where alot of people get mixed up. There is a difference between pagaism and wicca. Wicca has its own rules (witches rede/rule of three) and all the different sects of paganism have their own rules, often according to its influences and region. If one says they are wiccan..then they follow the wiccan rules, if one says they are pagan then they worship gods and goddesses but it could be anything. Sometimes people who are wiccan try to blend other systems into their beliefs, I think this takes a giant leap away from wicca and into paganism. I hope this all makes sense.

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Permalink Reply by Divinities Creature on November 11, 2008 at 1:28pm

It just came to my attention that some people say they are more witch than wiccan. What this involves is beyond me, I haven't really thought deeply on it yet. But since it could affect my earlier reply I'm going to add it. -sigh- there are so many definitons for so many things. Everyone's personal definitions make things very confusing,

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Permalink Reply by treehugger488 on March 4, 2009 at 2:59pm

i think that coming up with your own pantheon, so to say, is probably more powerful for YOU than anything else.. because since they are personal and you came up with their names, it will probably give you more empowerment using them than say, any other widely known pantheon. almost like a secret doorway to power lol.

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Permalink Reply by Vishva Kumara on October 26, 2009 at 2:32am

It is a wonderful idea and a good categorization. For me it looks more towards Chaos Magic, because you are taking Gods from a Fiction.

But remember that Tolkin takes a lot of inspiration from Norse Mythology. It suits very well for our Chaos Magic ways, and proved us a lot of material for our spells and rituals in Chaos Magic.

Since me and my girlfriend are so much in to Norse Mythology, we have chosen a Wiccan Last name (for our Wiccan name) common to both of us as "Calaquendi" meaning the Elves of Light. We took the names Merlin and Morgana from the Arthurian Legend, which also we feel so attracted to.

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Permalink Reply by Alorer the Greek (Wyatt) on October 26, 2009 at 9:03am

Well, you misunderstood something. The Gods aren't from fiction or anything like that. Only the names I chose for those 12 unknown deities came from Tolkien.

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